Besides MILES gear, what force-on-force systems have you used, and which do you prefer?

2022-11-10T11:58:18-05:00

I know there is UTM, simunitions, StressVest, and of course, airsoft. Are there any others you've tried or seen used effectively?

For force-on-force training, which do you find most effective for SUT? For CQB?

Response by COL Randall C. made Nov 10 at 2022 12:20 PM

2022-11-10T12:20:28-05:00

Back during my "kinetic days", I worked with JTEP and XCTC with some Guard units.

In the past 10-15 years, LVC systems for me are different iterations of cyber ranges (NCR*, CyberTropolis*, etc.)

With the advancements that PM SE (out of PEO-STRI) has been making in linking together and advancing synthetic environments, the "L" in LVC (Live, Virtual, Constructive) training is becoming less and less and are migrating to being a "capstone event".

After all, if you can meet your training objectives in a virtual/constructive environment at the fraction of a cost for a 'real world exercise', the justification to roll all your equipment out of a motor pool becomes less and less.
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* JTEP - https://silo.tips/download/the-jtep-takehome-package-an-aar-tool-for-distributed-training
* XCTC (FlexTrain core component) - https://medium.com/dish/75-years-of-innovation-flextrain-multi-mission-instrumentation-system-for-training-f761fde4be3
* NCR - https://www.peostri.army.mil/national-cyber-range-ncr
* CyberTropolis - https://www.atterburymuscatatuck.in.ng.mil/Muscatatuck/CyberTropolis/

[PDF] The JTEP Takehome Package: An AAR Tool for Distributed Training - Free Download PDF

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Response by MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P made Nov 10 at 2022 3:19 PM

2022-11-10T15:19:32-05:00

I only have experience with MILES and simunitions. Of the two, I prefer the simunitions because it is an immediate (and sometimes painful) reminder of where you screwed up. I found our MILES to be unreliable and didn't always record actual "hits". I've dabbled a little with airsoft on a personal hobby level and found it to be a promising platform for realistic training.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 10 at 2022 7:50 PM

2022-11-10T19:50:36-05:00

I don't know what it was called, but we used paint bullets (oh now I remember, SIMUNITITIONS). Literally the bolt system in the M16 was swapped out and the ammo were these CO2 5.56 shaped things with blue and red paint projectiles.

Then, as well, we used these junk paint ball guns shaped like real rifles, but larger, and bulkier and pretty lame. The "paintballs" were the size of large gumballs. They were nowhere near on par with what what hard core paintballers use.

Finally, we did use MILES. The systems we used in BCT didn't work at all. So it was an exercise in merely training us to be trained in the future when we used similar systems.

When I finally was exposed to MILES that sort of worked that's all it did, was sort of work. It was probably more than 20 years old.

Oh, and the OPFOR folks were given these rifles that POPPED and basically had unlimited ammo from gas canisters. They of course didn't have receiving miles gear so were effectively indestructible. So we'd get attacked by an invincible adversary just walking through our lines like they were on God Mode in a video game. There wasn't any Instructional Cadre around either and I basically lost my cool as the company commander questioning the training value of the situation and reeled in these idiots. So that's an opportunity for some comic relief in your story writing.

OH!!!!!!!!!! You might know, in respect to MILES gear............... you can effectively have unlimited ammo yourself if you tap the laser device on the end of the rifle with a stick. You cannot do that and aim at the same time, but it can make some pretty effective covering fire.