At what point do you notify your Chain of Command that a peer, a fellow NCO, has a drinking problem?

2016-08-17T23:58:58-04:00

Response by SFC George Smith made Aug 18 at 2016 12:00 AM

2016-08-18T00:00:03-04:00

Thats a Selfie of me...

Response by SFC George Smith made Aug 18 at 2016 12:01 AM

2016-08-18T00:01:06-04:00

When gets a paper cuts and evaporates to death...
Really ...
When he can no longer carry his weight... and the conduct and mental abilities effect the Efficiency of his work and that of the UNit...

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 12:05 AM

2016-08-18T00:05:35-04:00

I would first discuss this problem with the NCO himself. He may just need a nudge to self refer, or he may tell you to stay out of his business.
Either way, it is your duty to help.
It isnt clear in your post however, exactly what you deem to be considered a "problem." If he's consistently drinking and driving, absolutely that's a huge problem. If he just likes to tie one on after a long work week, well then I'd advise caution before inserting yourself into a problem where none may exist.
More clarity on the issue is needed, before a definitive answer can be given.

Hope this helps.

Response by SPC J.R. McCarthy made Aug 18 at 2016 12:06 AM

2016-08-18T00:06:55-04:00

When it negatively and consistently impacts their Duties

Response by PO1 John Miller made Aug 18 at 2016 12:16 AM

2016-08-18T00:16:12-04:00

Do they come to work drunk, drive drunk, etc.? If so, try talking to them Petty Officer to Petty Officer first (if you haven't already).

Response by SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 12:36 AM

2016-08-18T00:36:45-04:00

I would talk to him one on one first, but only if it's effecting other people... whether it's from being dead weight or causing issues at home.. From that point I would bring it up to the CoC

Response by LCpl Tad Cunningham made Aug 18 at 2016 12:44 AM

2016-08-18T00:44:39-04:00

You don't, you bring it up to him and him only. If it's a "problem" the unit will eventually find out. Don't rat him out though. Help him at your level. The chain will just fuck him.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 1:06 AM

2016-08-18T01:06:21-04:00

When it affects the mission or safety of others.
If that someone is underage then immediately regardless affect on mission or safety. Also if crininal conduct is a result.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 5:43 AM

2016-08-18T05:43:14-04:00

If you have to ask, then it's time.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 7:28 AM

2016-08-18T07:28:56-04:00

Ask yourself some questions
1) Does the drinking interfere with the mission or his/her work ethic?

2) Does the drinking lead to violent outburst or bad decisions that could bring harm to the individual?

3) Does the drinking often make then individual pass out or start to take a strain on his/her family?

Use a judgement call, each case is different some can drink a case of beer and be happy as can be, some can drink straight from the tequila bottle and be your best friend. Some can have 1 too many and kill someone in the way home, or abuse their spouse/children.

Response by Cpl Joshua Caldwell made Aug 18 at 2016 8:11 AM

2016-08-18T08:11:50-04:00

Pull him aside privately and tell his dumb ass to fix the problem, if that doesnt work then you need to tell you chain of command.

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 8:29 AM

2016-08-18T08:29:22-04:00

I agree with what SGT Bijonowski stated. First you need to notify the person in question that there is a perceived problem. This can be done in a few different ways. First, direct, one on one conversation. Indirect, by sending them an email or something similar. Third party, having someone else bring it to them because you feel they would receive it better from another person. Or command, and that by bringing it to the attention of the command and letting them handle it.
My recommendation is taking it straight to them. This could result in them telling you to “piss off” and them carrying on with their normal activities, or they could reevaluate their situation. In either scenario you need to keep an eye open to determine if the person has made any changes. If no changes are made and you still feel there is a problem then escalading to the command may be required.
Contacting the command and letting them know of a perceived drinking problem of a co-worker doesn’t mean that person will get in trouble so don’t be afraid of being a “snitch”. It may just need to be heard from the chain of command that it has been brought to their attention and they are going to be looking into it. If a problem is found by the chain of command they have the resources and authority to direct assistance.
Hopefully after all this the person will understand that you were trying to help, respect the reasons why and not fault you for it.

Response by FA Larry Wolverton made Aug 18 at 2016 8:58 AM

2016-08-18T08:58:43-04:00

Once he or she demonstrates that the drinking occurs just prior to going on duty or that it occurs at times not appropriate. The sooner the better, to allow the supervisor to help him or her get some professional help before he or she becomes a danger to others, themselves, or the mission goals.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 9:33 AM

2016-08-18T09:33:13-04:00

At a muster for rifle range the morning of a bender returning to the barracks 1 hour prior to muster so drunk they had to be dragged into the shower and then actually showing up at the muster.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 10:35 AM

2016-08-18T10:35:30-04:00

Before I bring it to the CoC, I would help that NCO as best I could. Giving them the nudge they need to self refer, walking with them to the place they need to go.

Response by PO1 Milton Wiseman made Aug 18 at 2016 11:57 AM

2016-08-18T11:57:13-04:00

As soon as you discover the problem, you must help your fellow NCO beat the problem. In the early 1980s we had a chief onboard deployed that drink vanilla extract to get high he was discovered and the commanding officer told him when we return to the beach you will submit your papers for retirement or get court-martialed. When they go too far they become a danger not to just themselves but to the men and women serving with them. Help is available for active duty and retired military. Veterans who have a problem and leave the service can get help at the VA for substance abuse. Help is what they need and they usually need it right away.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 12:20 PM

2016-08-18T12:20:45-04:00

Has their problem led to loss of faculties or loved ones been put before duty? Is it destructive. If so then talk to SM or quietly bring it to the next level.

Response by Sgt Tammy Wallace made Aug 18 at 2016 1:59 PM

2016-08-18T13:59:00-04:00

notify your chain of command immediately. alcoholism is a disease and should be treated as such. those who suffer from it are not operating at optimum health. our military is only as strong as our weakest link. help your fellow troop get the help he needs. help your military stay strong, safe and healthy.

Response by 1SG Al Brown made Aug 18 at 2016 5:03 PM

2016-08-18T17:03:01-04:00

When they have a drinking problem. Be a real friend, get him / her referred via your level Commander / Senior NCO and physically escort them with your 1SG (or equivalent) to your services drug / alcohol rehab center. Make sure their family is ok and cared for while they are gone and pick them up when they have completed the program. They will hate your guts on the way there and cry tears as your best friend when you pick them up. Save their life first. The career is secondary. Been there, done that, would do it again today if needed.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2016 8:03 PM

2016-08-18T20:03:56-04:00

When you think it's time, if you've seen something that makes you worry then talk to them when they are sober (and protect them on the spot when they're drunk from hurting themselves or others). If you feel the need to ask, I'd say it's time to talk.

Response by MSG Dave Rossman made Aug 26 at 2016 11:39 PM

2016-08-26T23:39:50-04:00

When it effects his job or behavior

Response by SSG Lawrence Jessup made Aug 27 at 2016 10:12 AM

2016-08-27T10:12:09-04:00

When your sitting in the NCO club and he reaches over and pukes in your captains hat.

Response by PO2 Michael Landtroop made Aug 27 at 2016 11:41 PM

2016-08-27T23:41:14-04:00

Never cause i was and just as bad

Response by Sgt Daniel Latch made Sep 5 at 2016 4:53 PM

2016-09-05T16:53:14-04:00

Drinking problems exist only when there is nothing to drink. If a fellow NCO has a drinking problem find out why: supply, money, opportunity or desire.

Supply: Inform your superiors immediately when supply falls below rations required to cover needs until replacements arrive.

Money: Give the NCO a drink for gawd's sake. Put it on a tab. Take it out in trade. ??

Opportunity: Explain to the NCO that there is a time and a place for everything (mostly) and it's not professional to arrive to work at reduced capacity: there is a duty to be present, prepared, and primed to give your best at every assignment.

Desire: It's okay not to drink but if you do and then stop, maybe check your attitude. The bar may be depending on you. This is no time to check out or chicken out. You may be having emotional issues about back home, feeling queer, conscious bothering you, ptsd, or whatever. Talk to someone. Tell'm you're not feeling with it like you did before. When your desires change it's a tip-off no matter how you rationalize it from falling in love to being reborn to joining a cult to changing your lifestyle for your gay lover, whatever.

(author is a former drinking NCO, excuseaholic, general asshole, and satirist)

Response by PO3 Butch Cowden made Sep 7 at 2016 9:25 PM

2016-09-07T21:25:27-04:00

Asap wish someone would have done that for me.
Was the culture in my day.
Led to lots of problems after I got out.
But no one will get help unless they want it.

Response by CPT Tom Monahan made Sep 8 at 2016 8:09 AM

2016-09-08T08:09:10-04:00

After you've had a heart to heart with the peer and see no improvement. Of course if you feel the peer's drinking is going to compromise or harm someone or property.

Response by MSgt Dennis LeRoy Duncan MSGT, USAF, Retired made Sep 8 at 2016 10:46 PM

2016-09-08T22:46:11-04:00

Immediately ;;; after taking whatever actions are prudent to prevent any further issues...

Response by Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 17 at 2016 4:55 PM

2016-09-17T16:55:13-04:00

We have a responsibility to keep the member safe and keep the community safe. Discuss it with him and then elevate it to his NCO if no action is taken.

Response by COL Mikel J. Burroughs made Oct 1 at 2016 9:23 PM

2016-10-01T21:23:16-04:00

ENS Private RallyPoint Member I would do everything I could to help this individual before it became a UCMJ action against him or before he injured others on the job, including himself. I look at alcoholism just like someone trying to commit suicide. Personally I will do whatever it takes to intervene and get them the help that they need to get out of this funk. It takes a lot of work and effort and sometimes you need to get others involved to help with the intervention. I've had to do this several times during my time in the military (as an NCO and as an Officer). Both times it paid off. Sometimes its too late. That is just my personal opinion and what I would do for any of our brothers and sisters in arms. Others may take a different approach or have a different opinion! Great question and topic George!

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Oct 1 at 2016 10:15 PM

2016-10-01T22:15:40-04:00

At any point before your "peer" endangers lives or missions. Now, just how prescient do you think you are to pick that time accurately?

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Oct 2 at 2016 1:07 AM

2016-10-02T01:07:53-04:00

I'm guessing immediately following a power drinking weekend, when someone calls you from either out of state or out of country, and with no knowledge of how they got there.

Response by CSM Michael Sweeney made Oct 2 at 2016 2:56 PM

2016-10-02T14:56:05-04:00

I was lucky to be able to talk a subordinate SFC into self referring. I had just joined the command and his behavior was well known and a joke. During an FTX, the BN XO came short of ordering me to inform our commander. I commented to him that apparently there were a lot of weak "Professionals" around him. I told the XO to back up and let me handle it. I relieved him of his duties, made him my shadow for the rest of the exercise and when we returned to home stationed, I delivered him to the hospital where he entered into the 6 week inpatient program. He was successful with that and made it another year to a good and sober retirement. Now I will say in response to the original question.... the NCO knew without a doubt that I was going to march him into the commanders office for a command referral if he didn't self refer. I would rather have been guilty of mis judging a drunk, than to ignore it and he hurt himself or someone else, which of course is the real reason to refer someone... not to prove how much of a bad ass you are.

Response by Sgt Kelli Mays made Oct 4 at 2016 2:02 PM

2016-10-04T14:02:13-04:00

ENS Private RallyPoint Member when you have exhausted all efforts to personally try and help this person and they either refuse or ignore yours and others from helping them...then they need to be reported.