Are we losing the ability to innovate through trial and error in the public and private sectors?

CPO Tim Dickey — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 07:57:50 -0500

I carried a 'failure is an option' mindset with me into the private sector, but both the military and business are moving away from innovation through trial and error. This is in spite of leaders promoting a culture that is 'supposed to be' understanding about failure. Do you agree or disagree with that assessment?

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Feb 20 at 2016 8:02 AM

PO1 William "Chip" Nagel — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 08:02:01 -0500

Pretty Fair Assessment Chief. Something I would expect from someone developing technology for Verizon and Spot On. I understand the Fear of the "New", We Humans are a Fearful Lot but it is something we have to overcome if we are to succeed as Individuals and as a Society. We have to allow Subordinates the Room to Fail since it is only thru failure that we truly learn or come up with better ideas. In the Military it has always been a problem but hopefully those in Power will realize this.

Response by CPO William E. Mahoney made Feb 20 at 2016 8:23 AM

CPO William E. Mahoney — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 08:23:55 -0500

Chief Dickerson you shouldn't look at trail and error as a failure it should be looked at as a learning experience that was the mind set that got me through 2yrs in the Navy and at Lockheed Martin as a Systems Engineer

Response by Cpl Jeff N. made Feb 20 at 2016 8:39 AM

Cpl Jeff N. — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 08:39:56 -0500

Trial and error/experimentation has it's place but most of us do not operate in that place. We are people that need to execute a job to the best of our abilities, deliver results based upon established principals.

In R&D there should be an acceptance of some level of it. This likely varies by industry or technology etc.

Being a teacher or a cop or a salesman or an electrician or a doctor etc. does not really allow for it. We cannot live with trial and error as a rule. We need people effectively and efficiently executing, every day.

Response by COL Mikel J. Burroughs made Feb 20 at 2016 10:28 AM

COL Mikel J. Burroughs — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 10:28:27 -0500

CPO Tim Dickey I believe the successful companies and businesses in the world place a solid budget on R&D and go through a lot of safe trial and error and I also think as human beings we go through our own trial and error everyday. None of us can say we are perfect nd haven't made great calls or bad calls or good mistakes or bad mistakes. As leaders that is how we learn. We have to make decisions based on the information we have and even if we don't have 100% of all the information we sometimes still have to make those calls or decisions (and in some case they end up in a trial and error type scenario). We take that feedback whether it was good or bad and we process, analyze it, file it away as a good experience or bad experience and then we build off that to improve or create the same mistake. Just my opinion, but leading has its' own trial and error!

Response by LTC Stephen F. made Feb 20 at 2016 12:26 PM

LTC Stephen F. — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 12:26:54 -0500

In my experience there have always been areas where trial and error make sense generally in the planning stages and those execution stages that are easily reversible CPO Tim Dickey. There are some areas where there is no room for trial and era because of significant risk to life, limb, physical property and/or mission.
Good leaders and managers know that giving subordinates the freedom to fail in training and limited operations is one of the most efficient ways to help them grow which improves the team.
Bad leaders always micromanage and have little tolerance for failure or deviation form the plan - seemingly forgetting that they were in training at one time.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Feb 20 at 2016 12:33 PM

CPT Jack Durish — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 12:33:44 -0500

I grew up in Baltimore and remained there until 1966 when I left to join the Army (and never returned except on brief visits). The Orioles taught me about failure. We had a joke in those days: What has nine a$$holes and lives in the basement. Yes, they never placed anywhere but last. I never saw them win even one game. (Of course, they won the World Series in 1966, but I was gone then) I guess that may be part of the reason I never feared failure. I learned to embrace it and to learn from it watching the Orioles.

How about kids today? Where are they going to learn to cope with failure? It's not allowed. Don't give grades. Don't keep score. Don't hurt their little psyches. Don't you think that kind of conditioning is going to have an effect on their adult perceptions?

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 20 at 2016 1:40 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 13:40:36 -0500

We need to take chances and protect our R & D from entities like China and Russia that steal our stuff.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaKK1fEHMC8

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Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 20 at 2016 2:30 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 14:30:27 -0500

Organizations seem to be more afraid because of the economy. Therefore, when I get a "no" on collaborative efforts, I work to find a way to do it with someone else or myself.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 20 at 2016 2:45 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 20 Feb 2016 14:45:30 -0500

CPO Tim Dickey, No, I don't agree. Why should failure be status quo, or an option? Failure has never been an option for me, and believe me there were times my dad called me a failure. That just made me want it more.