Afghanistan Withdrawal: Should US Marines have been mingling with civilians prior to explosion that killed 13 US personnel?

MAJ Montgomery Granger — Fri, 07 Apr 2023 08:31:40 -0400

Should better FORCE PROTECTION protocols been in place?

Response by Maj Kevin "Mac" McLaughlin made Apr 7 at 2023 9:57 AM

Maj Kevin "Mac" McLaughlin — Fri, 07 Apr 2023 09:57:30 -0400

I don't think they had a choice in that case. I assume this was the ECP and there was a need to review documentation prior to entry. The larger question should be, why did we pack everything up and leave the Afghans to fend for themselves? No residual support, no air, just a big fat "we're out, good luck, and screw you."

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2023 11:30 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 07 Apr 2023 23:30:52 -0400

I'm kind of the opinion a golden opportunity was squandered to engage the Taliban when they all came out from under their rocks. Can you imagine, with all of them out in the open like that.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Apr 8 at 2023 12:37 PM

SGM Bill Frazer — Sat, 08 Apr 2023 12:37:40 -0400

If you are not trying to control an entire flood of panicked civilians who speak little English- tjen you have to view their papers and physically block or move them. The bomb that was used chewed a big enough area that even a barricaded checkpoint would have failed.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2023 12:58 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 08 Apr 2023 12:58:26 -0400

This is something that you don't have a choice about. I have spent two years in Iraq. You can't just make a bubble around you. Especially in this situation. It is impossible to conduct a zero risk operation in combat. The best you can do is to reduce the risk as much as you can.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Apr 8 at 2023 6:43 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Sat, 08 Apr 2023 18:43:24 -0400

In complex environments like this, even if the army wants only facts, there is no way around it. Lots of staff sections who briefed the Corps Commander had to make assumptions. If we have assumptions, then we want the "strong assumptions" which are essentially the truth that has to be played out to be observe. However, assumptions like how long will the Afghan Government and Military last were broached. Warfare is not always linear. We don't ever see all the powers in play in warfare.

Response by SFC Robert Walton made Apr 11 at 2023 9:25 AM

SFC Robert Walton — Tue, 11 Apr 2023 09:25:22 -0400

This was rushed, any time you rush a withdrawal you are going to have a significant fails. Through History we have found a last ditch effort used when with drawing at the point your trying to meet mission standards in half the time.
Barriers are not in place, your short on personnel because everything needs to be accomplished right now. You are doing the best you can with what you have. Timeliness is paramount. But when time is limited you have to take shortcuts and accomplish the mission.
More time would have been the better answer. JMTC

Response by MIDN 2/C Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 13 at 2023 11:21 AM

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Response by MIDN 2/C Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 13 at 2023 11:25 AM

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Response by GySgt Kenneth Pepper made Apr 13 at 2023 12:29 PM

GySgt Kenneth Pepper — Thu, 13 Apr 2023 12:29:03 -0400

Those Marines and their attached support team were put in an impossible situation. Shame on Gen. Milly and his team for not taking responsibility and stepping down. I also can't fathom why our Marine Corps leadership didn't stand up and scream BULLSHIT. They let our people get sacrificed for political gain. A leadership failure from the highest level down to the Company grade on the ground who didn't speak up.
I understand that sometimes in a situation folks are gonna be left in harm's way and that is just the shit eating truth. But I refuse to believe someone wearing stars on their shoulder came up with such a terrible plan, watched it unfold, and didn't feel like they fell on their swords.
A simple "Yeah, that was a dumb fucking idea. Sorry Mom's and Dads" from somebody at the Pentagon should have been issued.

Response by LtCol Robert Quinter made Apr 13 at 2023 2:55 PM

LtCol Robert Quinter — Thu, 13 Apr 2023 14:55:36 -0400

I heard a retired military or government official yesterday tell a story of asking a five-year-old if he would pull his protective forces out first or last if he was leaving a battlefield. The kid said last.
If the military personnel advising the president planned the withdrawal, they should be held responsible for their incompetence, if the president ignored their recommendations, they should resign in protest.