Posted on May 10, 2018
New way to approach suicide prevention in the military?
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We always go over the same way of approaching suicide prevention in the army, possibly just in general, the military. We hear the same information over and over again showing the same slide shows or saying the same things and soldiers with little to no interest in the topic just don't care for what is being said is sad to begin with. Is there a way we can introduce a new method to push out the information and make soldiers and individuals more aware of a problem or more interested to prevented or helping out a soldier in the time of trouble?
If anyone has taken a new approach to suicide prevention in their units please do share! I want to make a difference when it comes to being able to teach my soldiers this very important and very problematic issue going on right now.
If anyone has taken a new approach to suicide prevention in their units please do share! I want to make a difference when it comes to being able to teach my soldiers this very important and very problematic issue going on right now.
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 11
Everyone has different experiences regarding this issue. Can anyone really assume the driving motivations/circumstances leading to this epidemic are identical...let alone be identically dealt with? Your question indicates you understand this as well, and it's a good topic for this forum IMHO.
I wasn't an "operator" or Infantryman. I saw people die, and lost friends. Some folks tried to kill me...directly. All in all, I had only two deployments the entire time I was serving...only one of which was on the ground, in the "AO", and even then, I wasn't outside the wire much more than a week or two at a stretch to as little as a few hours every week. I wasn't wounded. In every conceivable way we measure these things, I'd be the very LAST person anyone would worry about confronting these issues...
...and yet, without revealing anything that might compromise my present or future in this litigious age...I've faced my "dark nights of the soul" in the weeks and months following my return to civil life.
For me, the hardest part was confronting the loss of one identity...and the emergence (no, insistence) of another. After having a uniform that told everyone (including myself) exactly who/what I "was"...I had to find that out independent of anything the Military ever gave me. No one "cared" and to make maters worse...most civilian employers, friends and even significant others only saw that time I served as an "empty hole" in my prospects, abilities and potential.
I had to "re-learn" what the words "respect", "courage" and "integrity" meant because it would seem they have very different definitions out "here".
I had to constantly evaluate what I did do...against what I didn't. We all know that it never has, isn't, nor ever will be as simple as saying, "I served". We left the Military with a "frozen" sense of what we had achieved before reaching thirty...and a "blank slate" regarding what we might become from then on out.
I had moments where I revisited decisions made; wondering if I had hosed up...done right...in light of a maturing mind and heart, wondering if the greatest memories, accomplishments and pride of my life up to then were little more than a lie...or a joke.
That's when things get hard.
Ultimately, I pulled myself up by constantly focusing on the fact that in or out of the service, we continue to improve/degrade based on our own will power and effort. I found that by pushing myself, accepting new challenges, and greater responsibilities...the past seemed less important. I came to terms with the fact that choices made and friends lost were part of that past; memory is important, yes...but so too is living for a better future in honor of all of that.
When I speak with younger veterans, or those of my own generation facing these same issues, or here on RP, I try to convince them that sometime the most important fight you'll ever be in is with yourself. In that battle, the only thing that matters is to never, ever give up. It's a concept we universally respect, and the finest among us build their entire ethos upon.
To my mind, this is what we should be teaching service members; not that they are "broken", or that any amount of medication, therapy or aide will supplant the power of a heart and soul that refuses to yield to the darkness at the gate.
I wasn't an "operator" or Infantryman. I saw people die, and lost friends. Some folks tried to kill me...directly. All in all, I had only two deployments the entire time I was serving...only one of which was on the ground, in the "AO", and even then, I wasn't outside the wire much more than a week or two at a stretch to as little as a few hours every week. I wasn't wounded. In every conceivable way we measure these things, I'd be the very LAST person anyone would worry about confronting these issues...
...and yet, without revealing anything that might compromise my present or future in this litigious age...I've faced my "dark nights of the soul" in the weeks and months following my return to civil life.
For me, the hardest part was confronting the loss of one identity...and the emergence (no, insistence) of another. After having a uniform that told everyone (including myself) exactly who/what I "was"...I had to find that out independent of anything the Military ever gave me. No one "cared" and to make maters worse...most civilian employers, friends and even significant others only saw that time I served as an "empty hole" in my prospects, abilities and potential.
I had to "re-learn" what the words "respect", "courage" and "integrity" meant because it would seem they have very different definitions out "here".
I had to constantly evaluate what I did do...against what I didn't. We all know that it never has, isn't, nor ever will be as simple as saying, "I served". We left the Military with a "frozen" sense of what we had achieved before reaching thirty...and a "blank slate" regarding what we might become from then on out.
I had moments where I revisited decisions made; wondering if I had hosed up...done right...in light of a maturing mind and heart, wondering if the greatest memories, accomplishments and pride of my life up to then were little more than a lie...or a joke.
That's when things get hard.
Ultimately, I pulled myself up by constantly focusing on the fact that in or out of the service, we continue to improve/degrade based on our own will power and effort. I found that by pushing myself, accepting new challenges, and greater responsibilities...the past seemed less important. I came to terms with the fact that choices made and friends lost were part of that past; memory is important, yes...but so too is living for a better future in honor of all of that.
When I speak with younger veterans, or those of my own generation facing these same issues, or here on RP, I try to convince them that sometime the most important fight you'll ever be in is with yourself. In that battle, the only thing that matters is to never, ever give up. It's a concept we universally respect, and the finest among us build their entire ethos upon.
To my mind, this is what we should be teaching service members; not that they are "broken", or that any amount of medication, therapy or aide will supplant the power of a heart and soul that refuses to yield to the darkness at the gate.
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SGT (Join to see)
Thank you for sharing your own personal battles. A lot of different things to really think about here. A lot of information to take in. But with this awesome stuff, what happens if that individual is not on his way out the door yet and is having an internal battle with himself but has no thoughts of exiting the military?
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LCDR (Join to see)
That's a great point, and hopefully one where more resources can be applied. I knew a lot of folks while still in who had troubles off base...family issues, etc. Being a parent or a spouse trying to deal with deployment cycles and the risks associated can put a lot of strain on any family...or any member connected.
Maybe one way we can reach out is to involve families more...not just the "standard" Army/Navy/Marine Corps/Air Force way, but at the command and even unit level. It's got to be a lonely situation to be facing coming up short on rents/payments...then having to tell family, "I'm leaving for 12 mos." and not really having any solid relationship between the people we love back home, and the people we work/live with overseas.
The "mandatory" stuff doesn't cut it...but I've got to think that if we as leaders constantly re-enforce the idea that if push comes to shove...the unit's going to take care of it's own, to include their families...that may go a long way.
Maybe one way we can reach out is to involve families more...not just the "standard" Army/Navy/Marine Corps/Air Force way, but at the command and even unit level. It's got to be a lonely situation to be facing coming up short on rents/payments...then having to tell family, "I'm leaving for 12 mos." and not really having any solid relationship between the people we love back home, and the people we work/live with overseas.
The "mandatory" stuff doesn't cut it...but I've got to think that if we as leaders constantly re-enforce the idea that if push comes to shove...the unit's going to take care of it's own, to include their families...that may go a long way.
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Cpl Gabriel F.
One survives, loses sleep over all of it , shoving memories down with force. Work's for some Veterans. After deployments thoughts return for some Veterans with a demon. Months or years later when life piles up and on. The Veterans Administration takes over from the Department of Defense so that will be a cluster. Like the films and canned classes.
Faith can work for some. Prayer certainly cannot hurt.
Informal talking with other Veterans with experience will help others. Think what it took to get back where you are now. Suicide is thought about by some Veterans. It happens. All sorts of thoughts and second guessing. Suicide is just one of those thought that the demons bring. Not the answer. When death smiles at you, just smile back. Survival continues to be the answer. Stayed focused set small goals. Get through a day, half a day what ever amount time it takes. Remember fellow Veterans, the fallen Bothers never want suicide for any Veteran.
Faith can work for some. Prayer certainly cannot hurt.
Informal talking with other Veterans with experience will help others. Think what it took to get back where you are now. Suicide is thought about by some Veterans. It happens. All sorts of thoughts and second guessing. Suicide is just one of those thought that the demons bring. Not the answer. When death smiles at you, just smile back. Survival continues to be the answer. Stayed focused set small goals. Get through a day, half a day what ever amount time it takes. Remember fellow Veterans, the fallen Bothers never want suicide for any Veteran.
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I don't have an answer here. I work mainly with the infantry, so I may have a screwed view.
What I do know is that soldiers generally don't wake up one day and say "I'm going to kill myself." A significant amount of them end up at suicide after they have been overlooked or felt unheard or dismissed. The Army sends an important message that can save lives in times of conflict and that is, "suck it up and push on." With this comes a message that in order to be heard you really need to be in bad shape. "I don't feel right" or "I'm not feeling up to it today" will generally not give you an opportunity to take a knee or share what is going on with you. Rather, a response like "neither do I, now get your gear and lets go," is often received.
The opportunity to intervene early is missed and the soldier receives a message that the Army doesn't care. The soldiers feelings intensify. Hopelessness sets in and they learn that they really need to be in a much worse way than just feeling down in order to be taken seriously. Eventually they are at the point of suicide as either an actual option, or as a way of trying to communicate that they do not feel right and they are not being heard.
Early intervention, generally long before suicide is considered as an option is what is needed. Listening to soldiers, having them feel valued and supported will go a long way at reducing suicide in the Army. Its a tough environment, and toughness is expected and trained for. So it is hard to reach the right balance here. Some NCOs do it well, almost naturally, while others use times when a soldier may be vulnerable to try and encourage and motivate and toughen....and miss opportunities to listen and validate and support.
What I do know is that soldiers generally don't wake up one day and say "I'm going to kill myself." A significant amount of them end up at suicide after they have been overlooked or felt unheard or dismissed. The Army sends an important message that can save lives in times of conflict and that is, "suck it up and push on." With this comes a message that in order to be heard you really need to be in bad shape. "I don't feel right" or "I'm not feeling up to it today" will generally not give you an opportunity to take a knee or share what is going on with you. Rather, a response like "neither do I, now get your gear and lets go," is often received.
The opportunity to intervene early is missed and the soldier receives a message that the Army doesn't care. The soldiers feelings intensify. Hopelessness sets in and they learn that they really need to be in a much worse way than just feeling down in order to be taken seriously. Eventually they are at the point of suicide as either an actual option, or as a way of trying to communicate that they do not feel right and they are not being heard.
Early intervention, generally long before suicide is considered as an option is what is needed. Listening to soldiers, having them feel valued and supported will go a long way at reducing suicide in the Army. Its a tough environment, and toughness is expected and trained for. So it is hard to reach the right balance here. Some NCOs do it well, almost naturally, while others use times when a soldier may be vulnerable to try and encourage and motivate and toughen....and miss opportunities to listen and validate and support.
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SGT (Join to see)
This is how it is with the infantry now? How many individuals have to take their own lives because of hardships that they had? Those who just needed someone to get through it and couldn't find anyone to help him and he takes his life. Just sad that some MOSs and jobs have that mentality.
Thank you for your comment sir.
Thank you for your comment sir.
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LTC (Join to see)
Hi CPL Foster,
You are asking the right question.
The Infantry is a challenging environment, and I have been really impressed by many of those in leadership roles who are able to know when to expect toughness and when to offer support. It is the kind of environment that exists to train and harden young soldiers and the methods used make total sense when you look at it from a war fighter perspective.
Interestingly, the suicide rates for non-deployed Infantry soldiers is higher than that of those that have deployed. See https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4860903/
It may be that some are not suited for the MOS. It really is one of the tougher MOS's to be in but has one of the lower entry requirements. It also may be that the younger non-deployed soldiers are being lead by hardened warfighters who feel that they know what is required to be a good infantryman and who work hard to strengthen and challenge the young soldiers. Pushing young soldiers beyond their known limits to increase their self confidence and self belief would have a place in this MOS.
Lastly, I know, at least in the Army, entry requirements have been lowered, waivers are being offered for some behavioral health conditions and the pressure to recruit is high. I am a believer that, 'an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure'. Increasing the Army's numbers by lowering the entry requirements and providing BH waivers is likely not the most efficient way to reduce suicide rates. The price will be paid for this (Army health care, VA benefits, death payments to family), so why not keep the entry standards high and increase the bonuses for the combat MOS's in an attempt to increase recruitment?
You are asking the right question.
The Infantry is a challenging environment, and I have been really impressed by many of those in leadership roles who are able to know when to expect toughness and when to offer support. It is the kind of environment that exists to train and harden young soldiers and the methods used make total sense when you look at it from a war fighter perspective.
Interestingly, the suicide rates for non-deployed Infantry soldiers is higher than that of those that have deployed. See https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4860903/
It may be that some are not suited for the MOS. It really is one of the tougher MOS's to be in but has one of the lower entry requirements. It also may be that the younger non-deployed soldiers are being lead by hardened warfighters who feel that they know what is required to be a good infantryman and who work hard to strengthen and challenge the young soldiers. Pushing young soldiers beyond their known limits to increase their self confidence and self belief would have a place in this MOS.
Lastly, I know, at least in the Army, entry requirements have been lowered, waivers are being offered for some behavioral health conditions and the pressure to recruit is high. I am a believer that, 'an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure'. Increasing the Army's numbers by lowering the entry requirements and providing BH waivers is likely not the most efficient way to reduce suicide rates. The price will be paid for this (Army health care, VA benefits, death payments to family), so why not keep the entry standards high and increase the bonuses for the combat MOS's in an attempt to increase recruitment?
Occupational differences in US Army suicide rates
Civilian suicide rates vary by occupation in ways related to occupational stress exposure. Comparable military research finds suicide rates elevated in combat arms occupations. However, no research has evaluated variation in this pattern by deployment ...
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SSG Robert Perrotto
I concur Major - one of the hardest things about being an Infantry NCO for me was finding that balance between when a troop was actually in need of help or was just trying to sham out of a unpleasant task, I screwed up a few times (thankfully not something involving this topic) found a good mentor - ( yeah he never knew it but I saw how he was and said "that's the NCO I want to be") and started to listen, not just when they talked to me - but when they sat around the back dock, or outside our tents when deployed, paid attention to small adjustments in their behavior, got to know what was important personally for them, what was not etc etc - Our profession is a hard profession - we are the knuckles of our nation when it needs to fight, and we have to be tough, we have to be hard, we have to endure some emotional, mental, and physical pain in order to do the job required of us, but when the knuckle gets skinned enough, and the callouses are removed from our use, we need to take the time to heal them. you have to find the balance where pushing a troop beyond his limits to instill self confidence, toughness and the will to carry on against what that particular soldiers breaking point is.
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Take the guys that report to you and talk to them. I mean really talk. One on one. Listen to them. Don't just ask how things are and dismiss them when they say they're fine. Talk. About family, work, baseball, whatever. You'd be surprised what guys will divulge that can clue you into them needing some help. You can also do this with guys you don't know. If you see a PFC at the PX looking all down in the dumps, stop him/her and just talk for a minute. Where ya from? Married? Etc. A lot of time people are dying on the inside wanting someone to listen and even if they don't know you, they may open up.
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TSgt David L.
Fully concur, MAJ (Join to see). You have to keep your finger on the pulse of your troops, SGT (Join to see). If you don't know their good days, you won't know their bad days. Opening a dialog and really listening is invaluable. It makes guys feel like you really care, which I hope you do.
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SGT (Join to see)
I wouldn't have posted this here if I didn't care. It's that I want to find the best solution or best way to handle these situations.
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